Hello There, Guest! Register



Poll: Would you like to race with reversed grid?
You do not have permission to vote in this poll.
Yes
73.68%
14 73.68%
No
26.32%
5 26.32%
Total 19 vote(s) 100%
* You voted for this item. [Show Results]

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Reverse Grid for SRS?
#1
Star 
Is it possible to set up a reverse grid on SRS races? I am getting many races where there is a lot of action on the first 2 laps, but once everyone reaches their "fair" position, there is not much dispute until the end of the race... While I appreciate the points, I race mostly for fun. I'd rather have a disputed 10th place than a lonely 1st, and I see quite a lot of drivers like this.

I have raced a lot of reversed grids in the past (on "Live for Speed" online, and real life go kart races) and there is a lot of action for many laps. They are a lot of fun. And in my experience, if the race is longer than 15 minutes, the bests make their way back to the leading positions, so this doesn't take away the glory of victory.  

For those not familiar with this concepet, in a reversed grid race, the faster drivers start from lasts positions and the slower drivers from front positions. Therefore, when the race starts you are just a little faster then the guy in front of you, so you should be able to overtake him, but its not easy. Specially because you will have to defend from the guy behind you, which is a little faster than you. Now imagine that across the whole grid! 

The grid reversed positions should be based on the driver's SRS points, and not on qualifying, to prevent sandbagging.
Reply
#2
I would love to see that.
I think that it was done in the past so the system must support it already.
Reply
#3
If it wouldn't depend on qualifying, then the whole idea of qualifying wouldn't make sense. I'd say that top 10 should be reversed, that would prevent sandbagging, as you can't predict the time you need to be 1st - you risk being 11th or below.
Reply
#4
(07-11-2019, 11:50 PM)Krzysztof Witkowski Wrote:  If it wouldn't depend on qualifying, then the whole idea of qualifying wouldn't make sense. I'd say that top 10 should be reversed, that would prevent sandbagging, as you can't predict the time you need to be 1st - you risk being 11th or below.

This. I don't think that the SRS driver rating is balanced at all for the purposes of reverse grid... or any grid organization, really. Big Grin

But I'd love to have a top 10 reverse grid based on qualifying time. That sounds lovely, and is why sometimes on the daily races I'm doing well in I will intentionally sandbag qualifying JUST SO I can practice passing people.
Tutorial on how to use Autodesk Mudbox and Adobe Photoshop to make custom liveries! https://tinyurl.com/yaetz4qz
Grab my PDash Skins (an Assetto Corsa HUD app) here: https://tinyurl.com/y95ewubz
Reply
#5
The only viable option would be reverse grid based on previous results of the same race (like in Formula 2) , and probably for longer races than 20min. But this is really asking for more daily carnages, there s too much disparities with sometimes up to 3-5s a lap even in the first split past the top 5 or so. You can do that with pros in F2 so they can practice overtaking but this is not safe with that kind of difference in skill and pace. It would quickly turn into a random contest of moving obstacles overtakes, like it often happens in 1h events on short circuits. Ex on Brands Hatch, there were about 50 overtakes of backmarkers in 1 hour, who of course do crazy things, have no idea where to go under blue flags if the track isn't 30 meters wide (they wouldn't be 3 laps down if they knew), this already often doesn't look like racing anymore. Imagining those leading into T1, what will happen is they are going to bin it most likely every single time with 20 cars just behind...

Pace in the top5 is usually close, sometimes it really comes down to one or two tenths each laps, so if you want close racing i think there s not much other ways than trying to get there.
Reply
#6
Yes, there was an audi tt cup series in 2017 when I joined, which had 2 short races with reversed grid, at least the first 8, it was fun

this is the link to that championship: http://www.simracingsystem.com/leaguesco...d=k7KuqcuZ
NEVER GIVE UP!
Reply
#7
(07-12-2019, 02:19 AM)James Blint Wrote:  The only viable option would be reverse grid based on previous results of the same race (like in Formula 2) , and probably for longer races than 20min. But this is really asking for more daily carnages, there s too much disparities with sometimes up to 3-5s a lap even in the first split past the top 5 or so. You can do that with pros in F2 so they can practice overtaking but this is not safe with that kind of difference in skill and pace. It would quickly turn into a random contest of moving obstacles overtakes, like it often happens in 1h events on short circuits.

Agreed, too big skill difference even in split 1. Just make balast already,huh?
See you on track ~S!~ Big Grin
Reply
#8
(07-12-2019, 02:19 AM)James Blint Wrote:  The only viable option would be reverse grid based on previous results of the same race (like in Formula 2) , and probably for longer races than 20min. But this is really asking for more daily carnages, there s too much disparities with sometimes up to 3-5s a lap even in the first split past the top 5 or so. You can do that with pros in F2 so they can practice overtaking but this is not safe with that kind of difference in skill and pace. It would quickly turn into a random contest of moving obstacles overtakes, like it often happens in 1h events on short circuits. Ex on Brands Hatch, there were about 50 overtakes of backmarkers in 1 hour, who of course do crazy things, have no idea where to go under blue flags if the track isn't 30 meters wide (they wouldn't be 3 laps down if they knew), this already often doesn't look like racing anymore. Imagining those leading into T1, what will happen is they are going to bin it most likely every single time with 20 cars just behind...

Good points James. Using previous race result to reverse the grid is even better than using SRS points, although that is only effective if you are racing with the same drivers, which is rare in SRS. In other cases, using the SRS points (which is an average of previous races) is not perfect, but still better than qualifying.

Regarding big disparities, that will be a problem regardless of reversed grid. When unexperienced drivers start from behind (normal position) it is much easier for them to miss the braking point on T1 and take out the middle field. With reckless drivers, I find it safer to start from behind than from the middle, so they can't hit me in T1. Some of those who miss the braking points will be out of the track and out of the way in a few turns.

I have never seen the reversed grid for just the first 8 or 10 based on qualifying as Krzysztof and Marek mentioned, but it seems to have worked very well for them, so I would love to try that.
Reply
#9
Yeah it worked fine, but back then in 2017 (the link for Audi with reversed grid I have sent) the SRS was still starting and the grid wasn't that full of people. But it would be great to try this thing with a full grid of people
NEVER GIVE UP!
Reply
#10
(07-18-2019, 06:08 PM)Luiz Lotito Wrote:  
(07-12-2019, 02:19 AM)James Blint Wrote:  The only viable option would be reverse grid based on previous results of the same race (like in Formula 2) , and probably for longer races than 20min. But this is really asking for more daily carnages, there s too much disparities with sometimes up to 3-5s a lap even in the first split past the top 5 or so. You can do that with pros in F2 so they can practice overtaking but this is not safe with that kind of difference in skill and pace. It would quickly turn into a random contest of moving obstacles overtakes, like it often happens in 1h events on short circuits. Ex on Brands Hatch, there were about 50 overtakes of backmarkers in 1 hour, who of course do crazy things, have no idea where to go under blue flags if the track isn't 30 meters wide (they wouldn't be 3 laps down if they knew), this already often doesn't look like racing anymore. Imagining those leading into T1, what will happen is they are going to bin it most likely every single time with 20 cars just behind...

Good points James. Using previous race result to reverse the grid is even better than using SRS points, although that is only effective if you are racing with the same drivers, which is rare in SRS. In other cases, using the SRS points (which is an average of previous races) is not perfect, but still better than qualifying.

Regarding big disparities, that will be a problem regardless of reversed grid. When unexperienced drivers start from behind (normal position) it is much easier for them to miss the braking point on T1 and take out the middle field. With reckless drivers, I find it safer to start from behind than from the middle, so they can't hit me in T1. Some of those who miss the braking points will be out of the track and out of the way in a few turns.

I have never seen the reversed grid for just the first 8 or 10 based on qualifying as Krzysztof and Marek mentioned, but it seems to have worked very well for them, so I would love to try that.

What i meant was like 2 races in a row, second one in reverse with the same people registered, i have done it on public servers with friends sometimes but we don't care about incidents there, so still doubtful it wouldn't be a mess, it was most of the time in my experience and more about luck than anything else and generally just encourages you to do the boldest moves at the start. Even then the bigger issues is unless the races are at least 30min each or the new front row is really slow, previous podium might not realistically be able to overtake that many cars. As much as when you get killed in the first lap, very little chance to win that race anymore in 20 min (even in 1h it's a challenge, again if the leaders have any pace)
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)